Talk:Resources

Reformat

I think this page also needs something like what was done for the Poles page. Each resource can have its own page; hopefully this will help with spacing as well, especially with the larger auger images. -- Hyperchao 07:10, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Actually, the images are fine with the br tag, so never mind that. However, why is it that the images are placed above the header? It makes more sense to include it within the same section and it doesn't look much different on my browser. --Hyperchao 09:38, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

- Firstly, it is regarded as bad practice to use multiple carriage returns to space content out - that would only work if everyone was to use your resolution and window size. Different resolutions and window sizes however would either result in not enough of a gap or unsightly blank space between sections. The br tag is the standard method to space HTML pages.

- Secondly, it was done that way for a reason - if the images are placed under the header there is a gap between the header and the text content that looks awkward and ill-placed, putting the images before the header makes it more seamless to the viewer - and it is the viewer that the content is really designed for first and foremost. Making the content make 'sense' for the editor is really a secondary concern.

- Thirdly, a useful side effect of the image placed before the header is that the content that is editable from the 'edit' link associated to that section does not include the image. Thus, casual users are not likely to delete the image (either by mistake or intentionally) without an understanding of the page structure. Whilst there is no quantifiable evidence to back this one up, it can be inferred that most malicious editing is done via the individual 'edit' links associated to each section (as evidenced in the history of each malicious edit as the default 'summary' tag is populated with the name of the section in question, whereas this is not the case if the entire page is edited).

- And finally, this is the style adopted throughout the wiki, so changing the style in one place would essentially require making updates in every pole, resource, island, and more dauntingly, every fish description. As the old adage goes, "if its not broken, don't fix it". Since this would necessarily be a pervasive change, it is always best to ask opinions and advice before implementing such changes piecemeal.

- Back to the original question, from a personal point of view, I don't agree with splitting the resources up into different pages, nor did I see the sense of doing that to the poles. It was appropriate with the individual fish pages as they are transcluded from multiple places (the main fish list, fish lists per island, etc, etc) and hence reduces the maintenance overload from keeping those pages in sync. However this is not the same with poles and resources - they are only ever included from the one place. If the original request was purely for formatting purposes, then there are better ways to skin that particular cat (a la point one above). And since each pole is only ever transcluded from the main pole page, we haven't actually done anything to reduce clutter to the viewer either. That said, I wouldn't advocate changing the poles back to the old style now, but I would be hesitant in supporting the recommendation to change the resources page to follow suit until there is reasonable evidence of the benefits that this format has over the old style. At the moment, I don't see any however.

- Jasman 11:41, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Forgot to come back and check for a response. The main reason for the reformat would be to allow us to add more information to any given Pole or Resource that we don't want to be included in a laundry-list page such as this one. I think this can be seen with the length of the Tarpit Stout section of this page. What happens when we get more resources like this? Another example is that I imagined that we would eventually have information regarding drilling costs as a function of time-since-last-drill for each of the augers, but it didn't seem right to have them here. I think a page like this should list all resources and the in-game description plus some basic clarification if necessary (pretty much as it is now, minus Tarpit Stout details), leaving the non-essential data on each of the resource's main page, inside "noinclude" tags. Of course many of the resources are self-explanatory, but not all of them are. --Hyperchao 16:29, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

I'm not convinced whether its good practice to use the noinclude tags for that purpose, but in the mode of 'there is more than one way to skin a cat', its worthwhile picking up on the examples you highlighted.

1. The original description of the Tarpit stouts was a lot more concise but was expanded by an anonymous user (see http://fishwrangler.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/221.125.1.9 and then diff the first entry with the previous version). Personally I think the additional detail is unnecessary, unwieldy and actually has turned it into a bit of a mess, but its what of those things that no-one got round to tidying. I think that this one could well be returned to its original state and left at that.
2. The augers on the other hand, the description always felt 'out of place' to me where they were. Maybe because the explicit cost is on the page, whereas other resources that you purchase link back to where you purchase them (i.e. Earl's Lava Shack or his Waterport residence). Building on what you have proposed, I think the solution to both issues is to have a new page (called say "Drilling" or "Ice Fishing") in which both the details of the augers (cost, evilness/goodness) as well as the drilling info as proposed is contained. The auger descriptions in the resources page should then link to the respective sections on this new page as should the respective islands descriptions ("Fishing is only possible in San Digloo via the use of drilling with an olde auger" or words to that effect). Of course, given that the whole drilling situation is likely to change soon, there is no hurry to create this page just yet.

So yes I would agree with you that in some cases additional detail does not belong in this page, but rather than change the structure of the page to suit the rare example where this is required, I would ask the question, where would this additional detail fit better. In the case of the augers I would argue this is probably a whole new page in its own right. All IMHO of course.

-Jasman 17:39, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Well, I do believe that the information that is provided for the Tarpit Stouts should go somewhere. It is part of the game and helps us appreciate certain aspects (and Joe's humor) without having to suffer through adverse outcomes ourselves. I would definitely want to see more details like that and believe it would be possible with main pages. I can also see each Island having its own page so that we can better consolidate links to info about a particular island, and doing something similar to the Islands page, so this is not just this particular case. For example, when I search for Sans Culpra I should get to a page with basic info and links to all aspects of Sans Culpra (currently it's just fish, but what about what I can buy, scuba fishing details, trivia, etc) instead of ending up with a bunch of search results. Tying back to this particular case, the "Drilling/Ice Fishing" page would be able to double link with all the Icelantica region pages. All in all I think we could improve the wiki by having more pages so that we can have more information without worrying about being concise, and then having many more links so that it's easier to find that information. I am new to editing wikis so I don't know of all the options and best practices, but I have been peeking at the structure of other wikis to try to learn. That is why I have been hesitant to start making some of these changes myself. I also don't want to step on any toes of people who have been with this wiki since the beginning, so hopefully someone out there believes that the work required would be worth it. Maybe I can look into sandboxing this locally to see if it would work out... --Hyperchao 19:37, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

I think a LOT has changed in 5 years since these things was written, and all for pushing that most special resources get their OWN page. Trolling Net is a great example, as you have to rebuy it. I tried to look up Trolling Net recently, and not sure how to generate a search for it in the search bar. It did show up for resources eventually but so did a lot else when just searching for "Trolling". Jeydo (talk) 05:15, May 23, 2014 (UTC)

I know this is an old debate, and lot of them discussing it has moved on but I just have to chime in with 2 cents :P

"Personally I think the additional detail is unnecessary, unwieldy and actually has turned it into a bit of a mess....." Yes it can make unwieldy and bit of a mess, but I still disagree with this statement. This is what a WIKI is for, to provide ALL the info about that topic as well any related info, not just simple info that can easily be found in-game. IF the wiki page starts to become to unwieldy, than might want to consider condensing it with links to making stub articles to the rest of the relevant info for that topic. Especially when what one might find unnecessary will differ from person to person.Kevin "Hawk" Fisher (talk) 08:56, April 30, 2017 (UTC)

Attractant/Repellent Clarification Request

This page clearly states that attractants/repellents are used e'en when no fish is caught, but this is contrary to my meager (3M) experience. Is this true and I've just been missing it, or am I correct in that they are only used when a fish is caught? Seems I've read the latter somewhere or other...

Mixing Repellents

Activating three repellents at once (Boo Juice, K9 Pheromone, and Antifreeze Protein) resulted in the following message with my catch: "Too much stuff in the water - use less resources!" --Shad0 05:46, October 20, 2009 (UTC)

• And I think I may have discovered the effect. All three resources have been consumed on each cast until just now, when I caught a Cubey Fish despite my Antifreeze Protein. The cast used up the Boo Juice and the K9 Pheromone, but not the Antifreeze Protein. I surmise that I was just lucky previously, and that in reality none of the three three resources has actually been repelling anything (despite being consumed). --Shad0 02:12, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Right - you can't have three resources in the water at a time - only two at the max and Liquid Gold counts towards the two, as well. However, this page is more for the talking ABOUT the Resources page and how to make it better laid out, etc and not discussion about resources in general. that is best for the Water cooler section of the forums on here.

Thatcherw 03:04, October 23, 2009 (UTC)

Grappling Cannon

Text for completing Grappling Cannon:

Earl built the Grappling Cannon out of the required Cannon Crab, Plank and Black Beardopus Fish! I should now be able to ratchet onto the Ancient Mariner's boat after the Krakken is caught and moved out of the way!

==Shad0 (talk) 14:54, July 16, 2012 (UTC)